A disgraceful Government Minister

[Brian Probetts (Site Admin)]

Put him in the freezer! Call to axe minister over 'Gaddafi' insult to Arctic Convoy heroes in medal campaign



By Ian Drury

Last updated at 12:38 AM on 8th December 2011





Insulting: Andrew Robathan has angered the Second World War heroes

Defence Minister Andrew Robathan should be sacked over his insult to the heroes of the Arctic Convoys, veterans said last night.
He sparked anger by comparing the Second World War veterans' claim for a medal to the large number of honours 'thrown around' by Libyan dictator Colonel Gaddafi and Iraqi tyrant Saddam Hussein.
The beleaguered minister made the disparaging remarks after Tory MP Caroline Dinenage urged the Government to keep its pre-election pledge to honour the sacrifice by striking a specific Arctic Medal.
Yesterday even his boss, Defence Secretary Philip Hammond, distanced himself from the comments.
He told the Commons' defence select committee: 'I don't think he intended to cause any offence but there was an unfortunate juxtaposition of words.
'The role of the Arctic convoys is well known and if any offence has been caused I deeply regret that.'
More than 3,000 British sailors died on the convoys to keep the Soviet Union supplied and fighting on the Eastern Front. They braved treacherous freezing seas and ran a deadly gauntlet of Nazi U-boats and warplanes.
Of 1,400 ships on 78 convoys – described by Winston Churchill as 'the worst journey in the world' – 101 perished in the icy waters north of Norway.
Veterans Minister Mr Robathan, a former soldier who was awarded a medal for running a prisoner-of-war camp in the first Gulf War, faced a clamour of demands for his resignation after likening the Arctic medal campaign to notorious authoritarian regimes which handed out so many medals it diminished their worth.
He said: 'Medals in the UK mean something. Authoritarian regimes and dictators often throw around a lot of medals.

Perilous mission: More than 3,000 British sailors died on the Arctic convoys

'One can look, for instance, at North Korean generals who are covered in medal ribbon, or Gaddafi, or Saddam Hussein. We have taken the view in this country, traditionally, that medals will only be awarded for campaigns that show risk and rigour. Some regimes give out very large numbers of medals whereas we, traditionally, do not.'
But Commander Eddie Grenfell, 91, the leader of the Arctic Medal campaign, said: 'He cannot get away with the fact he said those dreadful things about the Arctic veterans. The man should be sacked from his job.
'He has failed in his duty. He is not the veterans minister; he is the minister against veterans.'
Falklands veteran Simon Weston said: 'The minister should think long and hard about resigning over this terrible insult. It was a cheap shot.
Hell in the Arctic: Apart from the appalling cold, British seamen were under constant threat from U-boats, warplanes and battleships

'The men on the convoys selflessly went into some of the most harrowing conditions with the knowledge that they could be hunted down and blown up by German U-boats. To suggest they are in any way like Gaddafi's henchmen is indefensible.'

Gemma Doyle, a Labour defence spokesman, said: 'These are sick comments and a slap in the face to the heroes who took part in one of the most perilous campaigns in the Second World War.
'For anyone to insult them is unacceptable, but for the veterans minister to do so is outrageous.'

Unsung: One of 78 convoys that braved frozen seas to help win the war


Lieutenant Commander Dick Dykes, 92, who took part in the Arctic Convoys aboard HMS Honeysuckle, said: 'It was a disgusting thing to say. He doesn't deserve to be in the job.'
Miss Dinenage, who has backed the convoy veterans' medal battle for a decade, said: 'The words were extremely ill-judged.
'It is impossible to overstate the sacrifices that these men made and the hardships they endured to secure the freedoms we take for granted.'


Harrowing conditions: Sailors chipping away the ice and snow from the deck of H.M.S. Vansittart while on convoy duty in February 1943. Thick snow and ice covered the decks and upper works of all ships
Some 66,500 men took part in the convoys. If they had failed to deliver the supplies and equipment, Hitler could have defeated the Red Army and turned his full military might against Britain. Only around 200 veterans are still alive, all in their 80s and 90s.
Successive governments have rejected pleas for an Arctic medal claiming the sailors had already been recognised for the separate campaign in the Atlantic.
After being criticised, Mr Robathan tried to defuse the row but stopped short of apologising.
He said: 'There was no intention to cause any offence. I was making the point that we honour people for their service in a very different way to that of authoritarian regimes.'
A Ministry of Defence spokesman said: 'The Government has committed to a fresh review of the rules governing the award of military medals. This review will be conducted by an independent reviewer with full consultation with interested parties.'








Betrayal: Commander Eddie Grenfel, left, called Mr Robathan a 'disgrace' for his remarks and right, the commemorative medal for British Veterans of the Second World War Arctic Convoy




EX-SAS MAN WHO'S FOUGHT PASSIONATELY FOR ANOTHER CAUSE... DOUBLING MPs PAY


By SAM GREENHILL

While dismissing the virtue of an Arctic convoy medal, Andrew Robathan is a firm believer in another cause: the ‘need’ to almost double MPs’ salaries.
He has argued passionately for parliamentarians to be paid up to £110,000 a year, nearly twice as much as they currently earn.
The long-serving MP says military medals should only be awarded for ‘risk and rigour’ – but thinks a pay rise for MPs would attract a certain ‘sort of people’ to the Commons.
His controversial call came in the wake of the expenses scandal of 2009, and triggered an outcry from voters.
But Mr Robathan, 60, has never shied away from confrontation, having served in the SAS before entering politics. He became Conservative MP for Blaby in 1992, and demonstrated political acumen by being one of the first MPs to back David Cameron for leader of the party, for which he was rewarded with a paid post in the Shadow Cabinet as the Tories’ deputy chief whip.
But in 2009 he was forced to defend his expenses as one of the MPs claiming the maximum second home allowance.
He claimed more than £3,300 per month in mortgage interest payments on a £2million Central London townhouse before changing his second home to a new property in his constituency in May 2004. Even then, although this resulted in his mortgage payments being more than halved, to £1,250 a month, he continued to claim the maximum permitted, demanding the taxpayer pick up his bills for food, cleaning and refurbishments of his Leicestershire farmhouse – plus nearly £1,000 in taxis to and from the railway station during 2007/08.
And in August 2009, he told Sir Christopher Kelly’s Committee on Standards in Public Life, set up after the expenses scandal, that removing existing allowances should mean MPs received a ‘quid pro quo with the salary being raised significantly’. He suggested they be paid £105,000 to £110,000 a year.
He said: ‘We need to look at what sort of people we want as MPs and what sort of salary we should pay them.’

[Tony Wilding]

it just shows what hypocrites we have in goverment, dont do as i do, do as i tell you, ! from the prime\minister downwards, all renege on there promises, two faced thoughtless liars, only think of themselves and feathering there own nests. dont know what hardships are, how did we ever put them in power, ? what would it cost them to do this honerable thing. ? when u think of the billions they give to corrupt countries.

[Willie Saunders]

According to another part of the article in the Daily Mail today,the cost of this medal would be in the region of£12.3 million of which £1.2 million would be for the design and strikng of it.How can it possibly cost so much, a breakdown of the costs would be interesting, as there are only about 200 of the men still alive. It states that the Minister in this case was in the SAS, pity his moral courage doesnt match his physical courage. Less money for MPs expenses is what they are more concerned about.

[Glenn Baker]

That Member of Parliament is a Disgrace to the British Race and should be sacked. The only honest person to walk the Floors of Parliament was Guy Fawkes. We must make it known to him and the British Parliament that our Arctic chaps were Heroe,s of the Highest Order. My best regards Glenn Baker Australia and Orphan of an Arctic convoy Merchantman.

[Lou Barron]

Its B*******DS like that who are dragging down Britain there are a few MPS like we have some here in
NZ

[happy daze john in oz]

Once againit goes to show just how little these so called representatives of the people realy know about the people they represent. It also shows just how out of touch they are with the history and traditions of the nation.

[George]

The man must be on the wackie bacey if you ask me, but then again why are these Guys still trying to get this MEDAL????? if the Great Winston S Churchill recognised the bravery of the men on the Arctic Convoys why didn't he award a medal??????, after all the Russian's recognised there bravery with a Medal, one that they aren't allowed to wear on serimonial occasions. As for the A' hole Robathon try the Bar Steward for Treason.
George
in Southampton

[Captain Kong]

I do not recall any members of the SAS serving on the Arctic Convoys, maybe it was too tough for them,

[Chris Allman]

I have not said a word so far as I was so afraid of saying something really rude and getting banned or even prosecuted. I am now really lost for words. MPs never cease to appall me in both their words and actions. They appear to be people who, once being elected throw any morals they had out of the window, that is of course if they had any in the first place, apparently judging themselves one of the elite and untouchable.

These remarks made by this current political a*sehole just goes to prove what a downward spiral this country of ours is in. A downward spiral of decency, morality and honesty. I fear for my children and grandchildren who are in danger of being caught up in all this and who are still fighting to uphold the true values this country once stood for.

Greed, slyness and dishonesty appear to be the norm now and that is just within our political system however it is spreading thoughout the country like a disease, a disease without a cure, unless something, or somebody, comes along to prescribe at the very least, a treatment. I am not holding my breath, just trying to stop my blood pressure from blowing up my brain.

Chris.

[Ivan Cloherty]

Herewith some email exchanges with the crass gentlemen. I am not very good, actually quite useless at attaching things to this website, so will have to do it the hard way.

My initial email
" For the attention of Mr Andrew Robathan

It is with regret and disgust that I read your comments about Arctic Medal for seafarers, both Royal and Merchant, comparing their requirement of a medal for a particular effort to those ofGaddafi and North Korean Generals.

Without the sacrifices of the menof the Merchant Navy, 35,000 of whom lost their lives in WWII you would probably have German as your mother tongue. Perhaps as an ex army manyou have disdain for other branches of the services and particularily the Merchant Navy as evidenced by your crass remarks. Without the Merchant navy serving in Theatresof War in the Atlantic, Arctic. Mediterranean and pacific no battles could have been fought. These men braved submarines,bombers, battleships, armed cruisers as well as some of the worst storms and seas to ensure that the military was kept supplied with materials, equipment and personnel, as well as keeping this Island Nation supplied with goods necessary for its very survival.

You should be ashamed of yourself, these men should be honoured and remembered and not be compared to some tin pot dictators. Perhaps you have an illustrious military background, I haven't bothered to look it up, but if you have, then you have certainly disgraced yourself and your regiment by your crass comments

Ivan Cloherty"

Response received

"Dear Mr Cloherty
Thank you for your email. Rather than the partial reports in newspapers, please read the attached extract from Hansard which is the speech made yesterday (7th Nov) on the proposal for a medal for those who served in the Arctic convoys

Yours sincerely
Andrew Robothan "


My response

"Dear Mr Robathan

Thank you for the courtesy of of a reply, it is appreciated. However the content of Hansard does nothing to dispel my opinion that you are not in favour of awarding these brave men some special award for the service they carried out. My father was on Arctic convoys, I have sailed the Arctic as a young lad (aged 13 and 14) on deep sea trawlers and can appreciate the hardships they must have suffered, not only from the natural elements but also enemy activity.

Perhaps you mean well, but I reserve my judgement on that, the thought must have been in your mind to even contemplate comparing a medal to honour these men to those self awarded by tin pot dictators.

I withdraw my comments that may have cast aspersions on your military service, as the Hansard report has shown, even the most intelligent men can make crass comments.
Yours sincerley
Ivan Cloherty.


I do not know how to attach the Hansard report, so have sent it to Brian, it's formatt apparently causes some difficulty, but it throws no good light on the speech maker, he may be proud of it, but it does him no service